External USB problem

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kevmeist
Posts: 30
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Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:51 pm

External USB problem

Post by kevmeist »

A NAS backup taken to a USB3 front port attached to a WD 8TB HD took 7 hours when it normally takes abot 2.5 hours.

I opened a TS ticket asking why?

Tech Support looked at my Dr Asustor log and told me that the NAS and the WD HD were having issues communicating. They suggested reformatting the WD HD (but couldn't tell me anything more about the issue). I did this (took 2.5 days). I then ran a WD diagnostic (another 2.5 days). Both format and WD diagnostic test passed successfully. I took back up on all 3 PCs to the WD HD. All ran OK and took about the same amount of time that they usually do.

So, since updating to ADM 3.5.7.RJR1, I find that the ADM Backup program no longer recognizes my 8TB WD drive. But ADM File Explorer recognizes it and allows me to browse the external drive.

I normally use the front panel USB slot for this and have taken backup that way for about 3 years now. All 3 PCs here recognize the WD HD and backup normally using Macrium Reflect.

ASUSTOR TS told me that they have not changed anything that would cause this.

After the reformat, the ADM backup program still does NOT recognize the WD HD. However, the ADM file explorer sees and I can browse the directory structure. I tried both the front and rear USB ports on the NAS.

ASUSTOR then told me that they made kernel changes in the last update and that this kernel is the one that will be used in the upcoming ADM V4.

ASUSTOR now recommend formatting the drive on the NAS! Personally, I don't see that changing anything. If it does, does the PC backup using Macrium Reflect then not work? Really??? A format is a format. ADM should NOT have a problem using a HD formatted on a PC (and up until the ADM 3.5.7.RJR1 update did NOT have a problem).

I'm now waiting on ASUISTOR to get back to me.

I would suggest NOT updating to ADM 3.5.7.RJR1 unless you have already done so. I asked TS how I can revert to the previous ADM release 3.5.7.RJ92 but they have NOT replied yet.
ndl101
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2021 4:32 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by ndl101 »

I agree, this does sound a bit odd but I cannot help but notice this:
kevmeist wrote: ... reformatting the WD HD .... I did this (took 2.5 days)
This does seem like a very long time in my opinion and, personally, this would make me wary that something is actually wrong with the drive even though WD diagnostics passes it. I have seen diagnostics tools from WD/Seagate/IBM etc. pass failing drive more than once.
kevmeist wrote:I asked TS how I can revert to the previous ADM release 3.5.7.RJ92 but they have NOT replied yet.
As far as I know, this "cannot be done" and I am quoting this as almost everything is possible with the right set of tools but I do not think Asustor has officially released tools for this. Someone correct me if I am wrong on either account.
Last edited by ndl101 on Mon Aug 02, 2021 12:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

I made it long as I lacked the time to make it short.

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kevmeist
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:51 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by kevmeist »

I don't think the format time is out of line for an 8TB drive, NTFS (note NOT the quick format), See:

https://hardforum.com/threads/how-long- ... b.1539045/

and other places.

Kevin
ndl101
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2021 4:32 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by ndl101 »

kevmeist wrote:I don't think the format time is out of line for an 8TB drive, NTFS (note NOT the quick format), See:

https://hardforum.com/threads/how-long- ... b.1539045/

and other places.

Kevin
First of all, that thread is 11 years old, but alright, my assumption was a quick format and yes, thoroughly checking a 8TB drive takes time. I guess there is a lesson the be learned by both of us, then. I should not be making assumptions and you should be providing properly detailed information.
While I cannot rule out the there is an issue with the kernel in the latest version of ADM, I still think is worth looking at other causes. The USB cable/enclosure could be faulty as well, even the USB port in the NAS. Heck, it could be any place in between the kernel and the drive.
Anything suspicious on /var/log/messages?

I made it long as I lacked the time to make it short.

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kevmeist
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Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:51 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by kevmeist »

I wasn't aware that I wasn't providing detailed information. A quick format only takes a couple of minutes. I did the long format deliberately, I would have thought that the time taken would have been a clue that it was a long format...sorry if it wasn't clear.

The same USB cable works on all 3 PCs here (mentioned initially), I tried 2 of the 3 USB ports on the NAS with the same result. I could be the USB hardware on the motherboard, but I have no way of testing that hardware.

Something of a clue although NOT definitive is that it worked for the 3 years or so before the last ADM update and that ASUSTOR TS stated that they did make kernel changes and that this "new" kernel is the one that are using for ADM V4 that is coming out soon.

Having been a software developer for 45 years...I know where my experience points the finger at and that is the ADM kernel change. Although that is obviously not 100%, to me...it is pretty close to 100%. I can only see the USB hardware being faulty as a slight possibility. However, it is strange the the backup worked BEFORE the last update and doesn't work after that update. It is also strange that ADM File Explorer still finds the USB drive (with the same cable) but the ADM backup does not even find the USB drive. That tells me that those two ADM utilities access the USB port using different methods.

Kevin
kevmeist
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:51 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by kevmeist »

BTW, ASUSTOR now want me to format the HD again via the NAS. Why that would make any difference beats me. IF formatting the HD on my PC gives the NAS problems (it shouldn't) then maybe formatting the HD on the NAS would give the PCs problems (although it shouldn't). I use the 8TB HD for PC backups as well as NAS backups. I took the 3 PC backups AGAIN after formatting the HD (they all worked fine). I just don't want to do the format all over again on the NAS and don't see why that should be necessary.
ndl101
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2021 4:32 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by ndl101 »

kevmeist wrote: The same USB cable works on all 3 PCs here (mentioned initially), I tried 2 of the 3 USB ports on the NAS with the same result. I could be the USB hardware on the motherboard, but I have no way of testing that hardware.

Something of a clue although NOT definitive is that it worked for the 3 years or so before the last ADM update and that ASUSTOR TS stated that they did make kernel changes and that this "new" kernel is the one that are using for ADM V4 that is coming out soon.

Having been a software developer for 45 years...I know where my experience points the finger at and that is the ADM kernel change. Although that is obviously not 100%, to me...it is pretty close to 100%. I can only see the USB hardware being faulty as a slight possibility. However, it is strange the the backup worked BEFORE the last update and doesn't work after that update. It is also strange that ADM File Explorer still finds the USB drive (with the same cable) but the ADM backup does not even find the USB drive. That tells me that those two ADM utilities access the USB port using different methods.

Kevin
I am neither saying that it is the kernel nor that it is not. What I am saying, though, is, that this could be caused by other things as well. Surely, your 45 years of experience as a software developer must have thought you that as well.

Now, I reiterate; Anything suspicious on /var/log/messages? Try monitoring it with a "tail -f /var/log/messages" while attaching the drive to the NAS, browsing it via the file manager and while doing backups to it.

I made it long as I lacked the time to make it short.

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OS: Ubuntu 20.04
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kevmeist
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:51 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by kevmeist »

I looked at the logs on the NAS. All it shows it is the mount and eject requests. No errors.

I have looked at everything that I can based on my experience (which you seem to take issue with for some reason). It all points to the kernel update OR the USB hardware on the NAS and as I said before I have no way of testing that the NAS hardware.

The very fact that ADM File Explorer works on the USB drive and the backup program does NOT would again point to the kernel update. This would seem to eliminate the NAS USB hardware also. There really is NOTHING left.

Kevin
argh0815
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:07 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by argh0815 »

kevmeist wrote: I would suggest NOT updating to ADM 3.5.7.RJR1 unless you have already done so. I asked TS how I can revert to the previous ADM release 3.5.7.RJ92 but they have NOT replied yet.
In order to downgrade to an older ADM version, you need to change all references to your current FW version in /volume0/etc/nas.conf - Version, Lastversion, Baseversion - to a lower value than the version you want to downgrade to. In your case you can use 3.5.6 for example. Afterwards you can manually upload the respective FW image which you can download from e.g. http://54.223.174.69:10079/download/adm/.
kevmeist
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:51 pm

Re: External USB problem

Post by kevmeist »

Thanks for the information about downgrading to the previous release. Not sure I am willing to do that yet. It seems like a very manual process and could be easily messed up. I still have a father/son backup that I take to the 4th bay internal to the NAS that works. The USB backup is just extra coverage to a different HD.

I still have the ticket open to ASUSTOR for this issue. Hopefully, they can fix this issue.

Kevin
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